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WHY THREE FORUMS? Well, this is YOUR blacksmithing forum to use for whatever you wish within the rules stated above. It is different than the Slack-Tub Pub because the messages are permanently posted and archived. This page is NOT a chat - it is a "message board" Our chat, the (Slack-Tub Pub), is immediate but the record of it temporary. DO NOT post permanent messages there. We refresh the "log" every 24 hours now and your message will be lost. The Guru's Den is where I and several others try to answer ALL your blacksmithing and metalworking questions to us. Jock Dempsey -- webmaster at anvilfire.com 07/27/98, 03/01/99, 05/20/2000, 06/16/2000 TERRY RISKE -- RISKE at USA.NET - Tuesday, 10/31/00 05:02:19 GMT Terry, I'm sorry to hear about your friend. That hurts. And your poem says it well. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Tuesday, 10/31/00 12:43:34 GMT i need some help. im a beginer sword collector and ive bee looking for a bladesmith(?) who could craft me a unique sword. if anyone can help me please do, and if u would please send me an email also. thanks ;djfkb zclkfjdvb -- lslider18 at aol.com - Tuesday, 10/31/00 23:31:50 GMT Dave, Very good tape and well done. Never had any problem getting good performance from our Bradley's Bruce R. Wallace -- service at nazel.com - Wednesday, 11/01/00 03:29:58 GMT CANDLE PANS: 3.5" - 16 ga. 10-$7.50, 25-$15, 50-$25. Also have votive pots, and pans. View pans at hotironinc.com Mike Smith -- hotiron at frontier.net - Wednesday, 11/01/00 03:48:36 GMT anyone out there know how to make charcoal? rob -- metalfabman at msn.com - Thursday, 11/02/00 03:58:59 GMT I bought some of the pure iron at Quadstate and it does stay hot longer it can also be worked much colder than steel. It is much softer than steel and forge welds very well. I took a piece and spread it out and thinned it to .035" folded it in half, forge welded it and then thinned it back out to .035" (approx.) I couldn't see the seam. There may be some that can do this in steel but I can't, I was very impressed. All this being said it is awfully expensive. JNewman -- newmanj at attglobal.net - Thursday, 11/02/00 04:38:39 GMT rob: yes I have little knowledge (been making my own charcoal for several years). What do you want to know? How to or what woods to use...(I’m guessing here) As for how burn wood with to little oxygen. As to what wood most woods except willow and related, they make LOUSY coal with HUGE amounts of ashes. I like alder, mountain ash (sorbus acoparia), oak, pine (pinus silvestris) and spruce (picea abies) in the order mentioned. Old Swedish smiths preferred alder, pine and spruce, they (several old smiths I have interviewed) claimed the best was that left over from tar making. As to how check my breif charcoal making description on http://www.angelfire.com/ca/pokerbacken/charcoal.html One thing is that the lid must not be completely air tight. I made a mistake there. It shoule be near air tight. But able to let smoke and steam OUT but NOT in. Another thing is that the fire should burn but not too much. I usually start with a little and when that catches throw on more wood (justso much that the small fire wil get trouble keeping lit if i ad 10-15%more) and let that catch and so on. Hope it is of help Örjan (Oerjan) OErjan -- pokerbacken at angelfire.com - Friday, 11/03/00 19:15:10 GMT As for how; burn wood with to little oxygen. As to what wood; most woods except ... OErjan -- se above - Friday, 11/03/00 19:33:10 GMT As for how; burn wood with to little oxygen. As to what wood; most woods except ... able to let smoke and steam OUT but NOT in.(like a sheet over the opening with a few stones on top to hold it down) OErjan -- se above - Friday, 11/03/00 19:34:45 GMT My name is Byron Clercx and I teach sculpture at the University of Idaho. I have a 36" x 24" x 8" hand carved and painted wooden anvil relief that is back lit with bright red neon that creates a rich beautiful red aura behind a powerful black symbolic image that can be read easily from over 150 yds. This one-of-a-kind sign is wired and ready to hang with transformer included. If anyone is interested in seeing images of it for point of purchase display at their place of business or for personal aethetic pleasure please let me know. I'll gladly email them images as an attachment. Honestly I'd much rather it go to a working metals afficianodo who would display it in context than someone from who simply thinks it looks cool. Best, BC Byron Clercx -- clercxworks_byron at hotmail.com - Monday, 11/06/00 00:27:24 GMT Bruce, Thanks for the feedback. Of course designers of Bradley [and Beaudry] Hammers had the thing worked out before they sold 20,000 of them. But we can make LG's work too!! Dave Manzer -- Dave at Wildroseoutfitting.com - Saturday, 11/11/00 04:33:11 GMT WildRoseOutfitting.com. I live way out in the canadian Sticks, and dialup service here is still in the last century. I only check out the Anvilfire site when I'm in Edmonton with a cable connection. Cheers, Dave Dave manzer -- Dave at wildroseoutfitting.com - Saturday, 11/11/00 04:41:59 GMT Dave, you have proved that LG's can work to. Had a 50# LG in our shop for 18 years. At the time it was the only hammer we had. Had it tuned up pretty good and it was a great hammer. We tweaked it into adjustment once and it preformed for us flawlessly the whole time we had it. Couldn’t explain what we did with much detail. We just fooled around with it until it ran right. Your video goes into great detail what needs to be done to get the optimum performance from LG’s. I would recommend it to anyone. Bruce R. Wallace -- service at nazel.com - Saturday, 11/11/00 12:45:20 GMT Nov. 11, 2000 Veterans Day: From all my family: Thanks very much to all of you for all you have done. Please take a minute to look at http://www.flowgo.com/refer/redir.cfm?page_id=1883&d=11-11-00 Jim Carothers -- colonel at fullnet.net - Saturday, 11/11/00 20:30:10 GMT I Charles D. Wodenson -- Dosenhof at hotmail.com/ - Sunday, 11/12/00 00:27:55 GMT Hi, anybody know where I can buy a scroll bending hand tool ? Tom -- tqtp at cybcon.com - Monday, 11/13/00 06:10:26 GMT Tom, Wallace Metalworks, Centaur Forge, Kayne and Sons, all sell scrolling pliers. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Monday, 11/13/00 23:24:24 GMT The November meeting of the Saltfork Craftsmen ABA will be on Saturday the 18th here in Perry, OK. Location is the Cherokee Strip Museum on the west edge of Perry -- about 1/2 mile East of I-35 on Fir Ave. We'll gather up around 9:30 AM. Join us if you can. Jim Carothers -- colonel at fullnet.net - Wednesday, 11/15/00 02:59:40 GMT I'm not sure why you pasted the entire log from above here but please don't do it again. Please use your real name or nick name - guru ;djfkb zclkfjdvb -- lslider18 at aol.com - Wednesday, 11/15/00 21:49:55 GMT New to Blacksmithing, and Im being schooled by Mark Krouse. Wondering if anybody knows of him? He started work in our shop today, and is very knowledgeable in all aspects of metal work congo -- mdsmith007 at altavista.com - Wednesday, 11/15/00 22:32:35 GMT New to Blacksmithing, and Im being schooled by Mark Krouse. Wondering if anybody knows of him? He started work in our shop today, and is very knowledgeable in all aspects of metal work congo -- mdsmith007 at altavista.com - Wednesday, 11/15/00 22:33:11 GMT Congo....You Win! He is hot. Pete F -- ironyworks at netscape.net - Thursday, 11/16/00 08:36:04 GMT Can anyone help me locate a good used power hammer for my brother. I don't have have a lot of money and would like to get him one for Christmas. Thanks for any help you can give me. Craig -- craig_thompso90 at hotmail.com - Thursday, 11/16/00 22:47:56 GMT Craig; could you hint at what continent you are on? Hammers are *heavy* to ship long distances; shoot I'm looking at spending about a much to ship as to buy an anvil I have my eye on and its still in the same country! Thomas Thomas Powers -- thomas_powers at my-deja.com - Friday, 11/17/00 16:34:14 GMT Hello out there. Looking for an anvil near Ohio or Pa. 100-200# range. Let me know, Thanks. scott -- Scott_wojtasik at hotmail.com - Friday, 11/17/00 22:15:24 GMT ANTIQUE AUTO - BLACKSMITH PUBLIC AUCTION SATURDAY, DECEMBER 2, 2000 at 10:00 A.M. 915 WEST OAK STREET, ELLETTSVILLE, IND. BLACKSMITH ITEMS -- 44" wood and leather billows - Forge parts - Forge tongs - Cone anvil - Swage block - Post vise - Crank winch - Chain fall - Iron wheel roller - Hardees - Antique hand tools - Wall mount drill press - Iron tire shrinker AUTOS - PARTS 1919 Ford Model T Roadster, very restorable - 1921 Ford Model T, complete except body - 1942 Willys military Jeep - 1936 Dodge w/suicide doors - 1948 Dodge w/suicide doors, engine in parts - 1956 Dodge 4 door, 270 auto - "Tons" of antique auto parts include steering, windshields, radiators, generators, starters, carbs, wheels, headlights, heads cranks, you name it - 2 brand new (65 yrs. ago) Jeep crankshafts - Wood steering wheels - Wood and metal spoke wheels - Luggage rack - Double T rear drive assembly - Several frames from Diamond T to Model T - Motors include: 4 cyl. Crosley, 41 Desoto, JD 4 cyl. stationary, Model T engines and transmissions, 2 four cyl. flathead Dodge engines, 318 Dodge, 1955 Hemi engine. MISC. ANTIQUES Brake shoe riveter, Old hydraulic and truck jacks, Old DG 32 volt light plant, Brass cylinder pump, Grease dispenser, Old gas cans and measures, Holbart multiport battery charging system, Vulcanizer, Weaveer tire changer, Hand bearing press, Large PTO winch, ALSO: Very old fan mill, Coal furnace w/stoker, Springboard seat springs, Sorghum mill, Steel wheels, Flat belt, Clipper fan mill, Wooden blocks and hay rope pulleys, saw clamps, ladles, stone jars and jugs, skillets lids, several tables from old Bloomfield Woolen mills, 1956 Ford 960 tractor for restore or parts. RADIOS Neutrodyne GN5 horn type radio, New Fada radio, Metrodyne S2472 single dial radio, Philco 610 floor model radio, Philco model 40-95 floor radio, Many other items too numerous to mention. Ron Dunn -- dunnrobin at aol.com - Tuesday, 11/21/00 03:38:23 GMT now that the cold weather is upon us (i have to break the ice on the surface of my slack tub in the morning), many of us have to dress warmly to work. question. is it wise to wear fleece garments to work around fire. i've heard that they can catch fire and melt you your skin, so it's better to wear wool. any opinions or experience? coondogger -- onehorse at mediaone.net - Wednesday, 11/22/00 22:10:52 GMT now that the cold weather is upon us (i have to break the ice on the surface of my slack tub in the morning), many of us have to dress warmly to work. question. is it wise to wear fleece garments to work around fire. i've heard that they can catch fire and melt you your skin, so it's better to wear wool. any opinions or experience? coondogger -- onehorse at mediaone.net - Wednesday, 11/22/00 22:44:47 GMT coondogger, Fleece would be fine, IF it is natural fiber! Natural fibers, (wool, cotton, etc.) will burn, but not melt. Man made fibers on the other hand (nylon, rayon, etc.) Will first melt, sticking to your skin, then burn. Very Bad Idea. I wear all natural fibers in the shop. Not for any "ecological" reason, simply becuase the smell of burning flesh makes me sick to my stomach. Especially when the flesh that is burning is mine! Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-pwas-forge.com - Wednesday, 11/22/00 23:19:14 GMT Coondogger: DON'T WEAR POLARFLEECE! It is polyester, and highly flammable. I'm with Paw-Paw. If it's not a natural fiber it doesn't belong near the forge. But then, I work outside most of the time at my regular job, and have found polyester fleece to be useless in the woods or wind. I go for cotton, wool, and leather. Alan L -- longmire at premiernet.net - Thursday, 11/23/00 01:23:10 GMT Hi Folks mind if i join in Dave L -- jetjockey at ironworks.reno.nv.us - Thursday, 11/23/00 05:09:51 GMT Alan, My coal forge is outside. I had one pair of Union Cavalry trousers that were re-cycled dress blues. Polyester blend. Lasted about three years, and Sheri was CONSTANTLY darning holes that scale burned in them. And I was constantly dealing with the blisters. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Thursday, 11/23/00 07:13:53 GMT Dave, Welcome! Pull up a stool, pop a top and join the party! Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Thursday, 11/23/00 07:15:50 GMT hi! first time i do this. interesting to see that there are so many enthusiast out here in the cyber world.important for for me at least that sits in a remote corner of the world, north of the artic circle!! you couldnt smith outside here in the winter!to my question: how do i make a shiny surface of stainless steel after smithing it(it gets a lot of scale)? its small objects for use in food? oona -- oonasmia at online.no - Thursday, 11/23/00 22:04:28 GMT Oona, Where north of the Circle? I graduated from Kenai Territorial High School, my wife was born at St. Joseph's in Fairbanks, and raised at Arctic Circle Hot Springs. A tumbler would be the easiest way to polish the parts. Use a soft medium, like corn cobs. Or if that's not possible, the buffing wheels with progressively finer buffing compounds, then wash in the dish washer. If the Dishwasher is not possible, use the hottest water you can stand to wash them with. Once you get all the fire scale off, they'll stay bright. Or they should. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Thursday, 11/23/00 23:31:39 GMT kwik note to all you"starving artists". I have an art gallery exclusive to metalwork.if anyone is interested in displaying their wares,I take a nominal commission to keep the lights on (I'm trying to make a living from my work not others).if you would like more info call me at 810 797 2563 happy hammering !!! BILL PALMER bill palmer -- klmnbrp at aol.com - Friday, 11/24/00 02:29:49 GMT Bill, An offer that is sure to interest some folks in here, but.. Some idea of where yuou are located would be helpful! (grin) Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Friday, 11/24/00 03:06:04 GMT I've got a Lincoln Ranger 300-DLX welder generator for sale. This machine has only 55 original hours on the meter. It is 300 amps AC 300 amps DC constant current, constant voltage and would welder and a 10 kVA generator with a 50 and 220 Outlet, and for 20 and 110 V Outlet's. Also an LN-25 wire feeder tachment that is also nearly brand-new. Included, 100 feet of cable, quick disconnects, and 2, 300 amp torches. I paid over nine thousand dollars last year, will sell for $6000 . NM John Prosser -- prosserforge at aol.com - Friday, 11/24/00 03:35:51 GMT Who knows, I just bought and air Hammer. The top die has no taper, the channel in the tup has no taper. How can I key the die in place? If anyone has any insight into this dilemma, please contact me by E-mail. Thank you John Prosser -- prosserforge at aol.com - Friday, 11/24/00 03:51:50 GMT I'm sorry about the somewhat incoherent nature of my last posting about the Rangers 300 DLX. It is 300 amps AC, 300 amps DC, constant current, constant voltage, and has a 50 amp 220 volt AC outlet, and 4, 20 amp 110 volt outlets. I hope this clears up any questions. John Prosser -- prosserforge at aol.comshe would - Friday, 11/24/00 04:01:29 GMT Coondogger: Pleeeeease, don’t use fleece or synthetic fibre’s anywhere around heat/fire/sparks. A friend of my father died from the burns he got when his fleece jacket caught fire and melting onto his body. OK!OK! He died from other causes, infections, chock and dehydration mostly, but the cause of those where the 40%burns he got. Synthetics are banned in a smiting/metalworking environment as far as "I" am concerned. Even a piece of metal that has been machined can be hot enough to melt some synthetic fibres. I sometimes make heavy enough cuts to get the piece to a nice brown/dark blue not to mention the dark red chips.... I know that I shouldn’t but it saves time and the part in question is not harmed by it and has a ±2mm tolerance and no surface requirement what so ever it is just a clearance (a 25mmaxle tuned down to ~12 in one go). The fact is that I recommend everyone to use only cotton, wool, linen and leather. Other materials are suspect and should be tested by the individual before use, or as I would say it A V O I D E D. I have myself had a rag melt to my left index finger, the rag was made from a shirt that looked and felt like cotton... PS. if you put out a fire on a person (or near) make sure that the extinguisher follows that person to the emergency room. Some treatments are hampered but certain chemicals and other chemicals are harmful/caustic/poisonous... best be careful. If not possible (you are using it still, the emergency team refuse...) tell the people removing the casualty what brand and type you have, and ask them write it down (give the reason), better yet have a couple of ready notes attached to the extinguisher (a copy of the label and your address phone..). those seconds can save lives, as can the note. Just my little input. OErjan -- Pokerbacken at anvilfire.com - Friday, 11/24/00 20:00:04 GMT Some treatments are hampered by certain chemicals and other chemicals are harmful/caustic/poisono same -- same - Friday, 11/24/00 20:27:03 GMT OErjan, VERY well said. Let me offer a couple of additions. 1. Take a thread from any piece of cloth that you are thinking about wearing in the shop. Light it with a match, cigarette lighter, whatever. If it burns with a flame, does NOT melt, OK, use-wear it. If it MELTS, throw it away!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 2. The tag you mention is what used to be known in US Military Medic circles as a "Treatment tag". I keep them in my first aid kit even today. On them, I note the patients pulse. respiration, blood pressure, pupil reactionary notes, and any treatments. Also the TIME of each of the above. Takes seconds to do. Tie the tag to an extremity, NOT to the patients clothing. That tag is INVALUABLE to emergency room personnell. I've had EOR nurses call me at home three days after a patient went to the hospital to tell me that my tag helped save a life. (My name and phone number are on my tags) Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Friday, 11/24/00 22:36:09 GMT dont forget the copy of the fireextinguisher label(content, brand, class type...)as much as you can get out of the thing. THAT TOO can help tremendously. OErjan -- same - Saturday, 11/25/00 08:48:12 GMT dont forget the copy of the fireextinguisher label(content, brand, class, type...)as much as you can get out of the thing. THAT TOO can help tremendously. and PAW PAWS advise too. Gennerally if you prepare you increase survivability, in a "situation" you wil most likely react better if prepared, like the cards. I print them on my puter and have name. (mine preprinted together with my address, phone..). what happened (short two lines) what I've done. and as Pawpaw said. pulse, respirationrate,pupil reaction, and extingusher data. allso have them 4 to a extinguisher . each with a 2 foot string tru a hole in the corner of the paper. and the papers in a plastic pouch taped to it (to keep it as clean as possible). OErjan -- same - Saturday, 11/25/00 09:02:26 GMT I think it is very good to speak here of shop safety and emergency procedures. It is also good to keep your doctor up to speed on what you do in the shop, as well as ( perhaps ) the local emergency folks ( ambulance crew ) and the fire chief. "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure" goes a long way, but preparedness for emergency does as well. Ice packs, Silvadine and a jump kit with emergency equipment are all good stuff, but the chief complaint of the patient and current status of mental and physical properties are equally ( or more ) important. If you call to report an emergency, the biggest deal is to get the ambulance there quick ! Any info you can get after the call is excellent. Paw Paw and OErjan, you guys should be sharing your knowledge at your local level (emergency folks) if you already haven't. You have more than a good grasp on what needs to be done. The Fire Extinguisher tag and other alert tags are very good examples of thinking ahead. We need more talk here of this kind of stuff ( although some find it boring ). And if the local folks have medical training available, and you can partake of it ( and perhaps join the local EMS ) by all means do it if you wish. You may be paged to an emergency and have some knowledge from your personal life that is lifesaving in certain situations. Keep it up fellas. Ten Ten Hammers -- lforge at netins.net - Sunday, 11/26/00 16:12:25 GMT Ron Rawhoof, I am in Rockford IL. I don't have any equipment to sell, but if you would like we could get together some time and do a little hammering at my place. Let me know Steve Crabtree Steve Crabtree -- coolcrabster at aol.com - Sunday, 11/26/00 17:53:20 GMT Ten, Good points. I've had the training, as you know. I don't "work" with a local rescue squad because as I told one crew, "I've zipped all the body bags shut that I'm emotionally capable of handling." But at the same time, I keep an advanced jump bag in my truck at all times, and I will not pass and accident unless EMS personnel are already on the scene. If Law enforcement is there, I'll pause long enough to ask, "Do you need first aid help?" If the answer is yes, I park and do what I can. If the answer is no, I get the he** out of the way. Most of the local squads know me, and if they see me at the scene, will ask, "Jim do you need anything? Or are you ready to turn the patient over to us?" I usually say something to the effect of "Let me finish the tag, and the patient is yours." They will all send someone to their truck to get any supplies that they can see I've used and put them on top of my bag for me to put away. Works out pretty well. I occasionally (every few years) Go through the local Red course to take the Advanced course, just to stay up to speed. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Sunday, 11/26/00 18:50:26 GMT I recommend a course in first aid and a WELL-STOCKED first aid kit IN the shop. The kit is preferably sealed dust and watertight container and everything replaced after use (and check dates on labels and note them on OUTSIDE of container). I use a 12litre bucket for my kit (one you can turn upside-down when full of water and no leak). Have a list of content in a plastic pouch taped to the outside (not the lid it may get lost in the confusion) with expiration date and such clearly noted as well. I will translate my content list as soon as I can and post it here (to be a base for discussion not a definitive list). Another thing is that you should try as best you can to basic safety guidelines. I would rather that someone else could post them. I have not enough grasp of the language to dare it. And perhaps it could be a permanent posting in 21century... (guru??) that and the first aid above could be a base to build on. Any further suggestions? OErjan -- pokerbacken at angelfire.com - Sunday, 11/26/00 20:27:10 GMT OErjan, Good thought. And I'll be glad to help with the language, I can't speak Swedish, but I think you and I can communicate well enough to be able to firgurte out any terms you are leary of. Guru? Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Sunday, 11/26/00 22:35:51 GMT HAMMER DIES: John, What type of hammer?? Many old mechanical hammers used TWO wedges. These were normally used on opposite sides in opposite direction. By carefully adjusting the wedges the dies can be made to align perfectly. Wedges normaly have a 3/16" or 1/4" per foot taper. Jock Dempsey -- guru at anvilfire.com - Sunday, 11/26/00 23:11:18 GMT SAFETY: We have talked about this numerous times and (I) haven't done anything about it. A good long section is definitely due. Some of the recent discussion brought up things I din't know or hadn't thought about. Knowning what kind of extinguiser was used on a burn victim makes sense. In the US there are only a couple types but I expect that the docs need to know their patient has inhaled "Purple-K" as well as a bunch of smoke. . . The non-synthetics issue is easy to overlook. You retire an old coat to shop use and forget to check it.. . . Cotton and Wool are generally safe but nothing with fleece, natural OR synthetic is safe. First Aid kits are funny things. OSHA burn kits have a ton of stuff for major burns but nothing for minor burns. Some of the sprays for sunburn or other minor burns are great to have around for the occasion non-blistering burn or weld flash burn. Restocking is important too. I suspect it is best to keep two kits in the shop. Major Injury and Minor Injury and NEVER, EVER, EVER open the Major Kit unless it really is a major injury. Every time I've gone to a "shop kit" all the minor suff was gone and the rest rifled through looking for more. . . Manyplaces keep fire buckets in the shop filled with sand. The sand is good because it will be there when you need it. But this is another of those areas where you have to keep strict shop (or personal) rules. If you go to use it and it isn't there. . . . Jock D. -- guru at anvilfire.com - Sunday, 11/26/00 23:30:36 GMT Copied from another source. The Blacsmith's 12 Days of Christmas On the first day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, a cartridge in a bare tree. On the second day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the third day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, 3 Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the fourth day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, four tons of coal, three Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the fifth day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, FIVE SPATULASSSS. Four tons of coal, three Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the sixth day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, six chunks of babbit ,FIVE SPATULASSSS. Four tons of coal, three Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the seventh day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, seven brand new swedge blocks, six chunks of babbit, FIVE SPATULASSSS. Four tons of coal, three Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the eighth day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, eight hand forged punches, seven brand new swedge blocks, six chunks of babbit, FIVE SPATULASSSS. Four tons of coal, three Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the ninth day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, nine Mouse Hole anvils, eight hand forged punches, seven brand new swedge blocks, six chunks of babbit, FIVE SPATULASSSS. Four tons of coal, three Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the tenth day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, Ten Hammer handles, nine Mouse Hole anvils, eight hand forged punches, seven brand new swedge blocks, six chunks of babbit, FIVE SPATULASSSS. Four tons of coal, three Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the eleventh day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, eleven hand forged trivets, Ten Hammer handles, nine Mouse Hole anvils, eight hand forged punches, seven brand new swedge blocks, six chunks of babbit, FIVE SPATULASSSS. Four tons of coal, three Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a cartridge in a bare tree. On the twelveth day of Christmas, my Blacksmith gave to me, twelve scrolls with collars, eleven hand forged trivets, Ten Hammer handles, nine Mouse Hole anvils, eight hand forged punches, seven brand new swedge blocks, six chunks of babbit, FIVE SPATULASSSS. Four tons of coal, thre-ee Betty Lamps, two pairs of tongs and a caaartriige in a bare tree. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Monday, 11/27/00 02:37:16 GMT Hi guys, If I might add to the discussion on safety. Check out your tools. I'm thinking primarily of cutting and grinding discs. Worked in a steel fab shop four years. We used Flexovit brand discs, American made. The boss decided he would save some money and bought some off brand. My son set his jacket on fire while grinding. after we got the fire out and his arm bandaged I picked up the same grinder and tried it. It set a 100% cotton shirt on fire while I was in it. The boss said just coincidence. We said bad discs and wouldnt use them. There had to be some chemical composition in the disc to start two fires in five minutes. Also we had trouble with discs being out of round and chips flying off. Always discs from Taiwan, Korea, China. Check the point of manufacture. Some offshore tools are okay but a grinder is the most dangerous piece of equipment in the shop. Also if a grinder falls off the table check the disc for cracks. Dont take a chance. Larry F. -- Blueheron419 - Monday, 11/27/00 02:54:15 GMT Hi gang, just a reminder while on the topic of saftey, please get roll bars and seatbelts on those tractors. 1 lost friend is 1 to many. Happy turkey day... Stiffy Stiffy -- mklbjean at k-inc.com - Monday, 11/27/00 05:22:56 GMT i work alone in my shop most of the time. no phone there. fortunately it's close enough to the house that a portable phone with the base antenna extended across my bedroom window works. if you don't have a phone, cell or hardline, in your shop and especially if you work alone, it might be the most important "safety" equipment you could acquire. dennis smith -- dsmith3725 at aol - Monday, 11/27/00 11:57:55 GMT another safety tip even though you may be wearing all cotton if it is frayed it will burn fast. Try using an arc welder with frayed cuffs on a pair of jeens, with the hood down you don't know you are on fire untill it's too late., kid - Monday, 11/27/00 22:54:43 GMT Yep, any material, natural or not, that has a noticeable "nap" or fuzz WILL burst into flame, even kevlar gloves! Alan L -- longmire at premiernet.net - Tuesday, 11/28/00 01:34:00 GMT Wool and cotton are definately safer clothing while working around flame and sparks. No intention of opening a can of worms here, but smouldering wool produces a small amount of cyanide gas. R. Guess -- RanDGuess - Tuesday, 11/28/00 02:41:49 GMT Paw Paw, 10-4. Knew your situation. Guess I should have made statement more clearly. The invitation to take training as for ALL. Your community is very lucky to have you for not only your training, but your experience. My jump kit is pretty simple. Something to stop blood ( using direct pressure ). This consists of a large multi-trauma dressing, and a fist full of 4 x 4's. I keep a box of gloves, and they are non latex. Some folks are allergic to latex, and don't want any problems. I've got a cuff and scope for taking blood pressure. A small flashlight and some duct tape. Paper and a writing instrument ( a " sharpie " works well ). In training, you should learn important things to document ( like Paw Paw and OErjan have listed ). Sometimes the most important thing you will do is keep the patient calm, and stop the leak (blood). Or, you may just keep the patient immobile to prevent further injury ( in a fall ). This all assumes you've called for help if you need it. Thinking clearly can be the biggest challenge. Medical emergencies are another deal altogether. Much training is available, and a lot of it is free. We all should have CPR / Blocked airway training, and basic first aid. Good ideas here on many things ( I been on fire from frayed britches too ). The fire extinguisher lable is an excellent example of thinking clearly, and passing on the chain of events that transpired in an injury. BTW. one of those small " space blankets " or even a small 5 x 6 plastic tarp ( blue one side, silver on the other ) is good to have in your jump kit. Good stuff on the discussions folks. We can all learn from mistakes and (unfortunately) some of the mistakes are ugly. Steve O'Grady -- lforge at netins.net - Tuesday, 11/28/00 11:36:40 GMT Steve, No problem! I knew it was a general statement. My kit has a little more in it. A saline IV, (to be used for wor wound flush) an oto-scope, a few pressure packs, (military style. Kit, First Aid, Individual Dressing) I do have the space blanket, one of the large one. No tarp, but that's a good thought. Also have one of the chemical hot packs, and several of the chemical cold packs. Treatment Tags, and the normal "minor" items. Since I'm allergic to venom, I also carry injectible Benadryl, and Eppy, WITH the scrip authorizeing me to carry them. (Most folks would not need or carry those) One item that I carry strictly for myself is Zylocaine injectible. (again, I carry the scrip for that too) That can be used as a local for severe lacerations if I can reach the site of the wound. Folks, I could do a complete inventory of the kit I carry in the truck AND of the kit in the shop. Steve, OErjan, and Tom Stovall would be willing to do the same, I'm sure. Would that help those of you with less background and experience? Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Tuesday, 11/28/00 14:12:57 GMT British Amateur Needs Help Hi All, what a great place and obviously a good bunch of people post here regularly. My question is for any British blacksmiths out there. Where on earth do you guys get your tools? I’m strictly an amateur and I’ve been looking for a new blower for months but can I find one? I’ve worn out two vacuum cleaner motors this year already. I can find loads of them from America and even some great antique ones on E-bay but the shipping costs for these things are 3 times as much as the item itself. SO what I’m after are some addresses, phone numbers, URLs or anything really that will put me in touch with suppliers over here. I know you must be able to get these things over here but where? Thanks in advance Pistol Pete Pistol Pete -- pistolpete at 24-7freecall.net - Tuesday, 11/28/00 14:14:44 GMT Pistol Pete Sent you an Email. Try a greenhouse or horticultural supplier. They use a small squirrelcage fan to inflate between the layers of plastic on a double poly film greenhouse. This type of greenhouse is more popular in the U S than in Europe or England, but it's worth a try. A heating/airconditioning service company might have a blower fan for a house furnace; I have a wood burning furnace that has a squirrel cage fan to build up the fire. Good Luck Nolan -- Ndorsey at ck.tec.ok.us - Tuesday, 11/28/00 17:05:29 GMT Pistol Pete Try Glendale Forge tools, Monk Street,Thaxted,Essex CM6 2NR, Tel 01371 830466, Web site www.armoury.demon.co.uk/glendale They have a full catalogue from hammers to forges, they also (or at least did) a second hand service. You could also try Vaughans (hope works) Baker House, The Hayes,Lye,Stourbridge,West Midlands, DY9 8RS, tel 01384 424232. wayne -- pastlincs at aol.com - Tuesday, 11/28/00 18:01:42 GMT Hi again. Thanks for the help guys! I really appreciate it, if you need PC support just email me!! Pistol Pistol Pete -- pistolpete at 24-7freecal.net - Tuesday, 11/28/00 20:46:58 GMT I'm new to blacksmithing and was wondering if anyone new of a place in the Tulsa, OK area that sold blacksmithing supplies or equipment.Thank you. David -- manen at sdown.com - Wednesday, 11/29/00 01:21:52 GMT Several folks with a lot more knowledge than myself have written at length on the content of shop first aid kits, so I'll touch on a couple of things I think are important. I think a cell phone in arm's reach is probably the most important safety device in the shop. Since I usually work alone, the ability to get help of the 911 variety in an emergency might be the difference between life and death. I hate to admit it, buy my first aid kit ain't much. It's mostly band aids, tweezers, and burn ointment: I tend to think more in terms of prevention than cure. That said, there are enough polycarbonate safety glasses in the shop to outfit a regiment. Thataway, I'm never tempted to fire up a grinder or, worse yet, a wire wheel, without putting on a pair of safety glasses. I have a concrete floor in the shop. As a consequence, I have surplus rubber conveyor belt out of a ready mix plant laid down in front of the layout table, the burning table and in front of all the pedestal mounted grinders, wheels, sanders and saws. Standing on concrete all day, no matter what the footgear, makes my back hurt worse than shoeing horses and I figure rubber matting is cheaper than chiropractors. I don't wear loose clothing in the shop. Ever. catching a shirt sleeve in a twisted wire wheel turning at 3,600 rpm can ruin more than your shirt. When I'm welding or cutting, I wear britches that cover my shoes. There's not enough room in a shoe for my foot and hot buckshot too. For them as uses a plasma cutter, a special word of caution: use positive ventilation and wear a mask! The tiny particles that are the end product of plasma cutting probably won't do your lungs any good. Ditto for grinding/sanding. Lungs function better without abrasive content. Folks who light a fire - gas or coal - in any unventilated area are taking a chance on waking up dead. Carbon monoxide poisoning is a possibility any time a fire is lit; fans are cheap. Finally, a word on my nemesis, the wire wheel. I have a Rube Goldberg safety device on the Baldor wire wheel, but I still haven't quite figured out how to keep the hand-held wire wheels from occasionally blessing my body with their presence - they attack when least expected. They wait patiently for the slightest bit of carelessness, then pounce with the ruthlessness of the most savage predator. I've got scars to prove it. Probably the best advice anybody can give - or take - sounds trite in its simplicity, but it works: Be careful! Tom Stovall -- stovall at wt.net - Wednesday, 11/29/00 12:28:01 GMT One area that hasn't been closely addressed yet. When I demonstrate, usually Sheri is with me. She ALWAYS has an Aloe Vera plant with us. That's Mother Nature's first aid kit in a plant! Few years back I got badly burned at a show. My had slipped on a long piece of 1/2" round stock. Slid all the way down the thear that was almost white hot. INSTANT second degree on the pads of all for fingers, AND more in the palm of my hand. I handed the iron (cold end naturally) to the son that had moved a jig for me turned to the foster son that was working with us and said "Ice Chest!" Ron said later that was the first time he'd ever seen human flesh steam! There was a rescue squad there, but they didn't have ANYTHING to work with. The jump bag in my truck was better equipped! And I still needed to work. For the rest of that day, I'd hold ice till I couldn't stand it any more, momma would wipe the hand down with the sap from a piece of Aloe Ver, I'd put a glove on and work. When I couldnt' stand it any longer, repeat the process. I don't even have any scars. Just the memories, and a little loss of tactile sensation in a couple of finger tips. We keep several plants around the house and ALWAYS take one with us when we go to a show. I've been known to turn around and drive back 15 miles when we forgot it. I've also been known to go to a stor and pay an outrageous price for one when we've forgotton it. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Wednesday, 11/29/00 14:27:08 GMT thear = to the area for = four stor = store Paw Paw Wilson -- same - Wednesday, 11/29/00 14:29:43 GMT looking for hand-cranked blower/s reasonably priced fletcher wynn -- fletcherwynn at hotmail.com - Wednesday, 11/29/00 16:41:55 GMT here comes a list that i use in my shop (with coments and aditions from earlyer in this forum. hope we can use this as a base to build furter on (yes it wil be edited and get paragraphs... according to any coments.I would like it to list some english first aid manuals/courses (I'll add swedish ones later this is just a first atempt), be cruel to me it might save lives later. rather: point mistakes out and give your alternative and the reason for it. here goes first aid: Just to start i want to say that we all should have CPR / Blocked airway training, and basic first aid training as said earlyer (thanks Steve O'Grady for pointing it out). I recommend a course in first aid and a WELL-STOCKED first aid kit IN the shop (see below). Generally if you prepare you increase survivability, in a "situation" you will most likely react better if prepared, to take an example the “tags” are one small but vital thing in some situations (se below). 3 large trauma dressings (I think it is what pawpaw called military style. First Aid, Individual Dressing), 3pcs of elastic and regular gauze (10’ by3”), Paracetamol AND salicylic acid (some people are alergic to one or the other, so ask), Tweezers (two), eye wash WITH CUP, Scissors: 3 different: one straight, one curved and a heavy duty (for jeans, boots...), Plastic gloves, (pawpaw I need help here) two scissor-like clamps, Sunburn lotion, Antiseptic solution (only to be used when CLEAN water and soap are not an option), stickingplasters, One of those masks to give mouth to mouth (probably has a name, pawpaw??), A BUNCH (about ten each) of 3x3 and 4x4 gauze, Cling film *(same that you use for food), A small flashlight (I prefer a Quality one like a maglite, MityLite, sabrelite or similar), Some duct tape (good for so much that it is in ALL my toolboxes, first aid kits...) And lastly a good SHARP knife. 95%of the case it is used to cut things like seatbelts, rope, clothing... to free a person, just be careful so you dont make things worse. have a few of the chemical hot packs and a few of the chemical cold packs, I added the “several” as I live far north and cold is a KILLER... (thanks pawpaw will ad these asap) the cold packs are good on bruises and burns here we have ice/snow 7months of the year so... not that much of a priority, will add a few though, never hurts and is no great expense *The Clingfilm is to wrap burns with to prevent contamination and dehydration. Burns are mostly to be considered sterile (if not touched by someone with unwashed hands or otherwise contaminated). Just remove LARGE particles and then wrap, let the doctors take care of the small stuff and treatment. On chemical burns you can’t do this but must rinse in water as long as possible instead. It only works on heat burns past the “sunburn stage”. I also have a Wool blanket. Wool as it is both warm (even when damp) AND “fireproof” for short periods of time so you can extinguish fires on persons with it and afterwards keep the person warm (wont smell nice after the fire but...), I recommend a course in first aid and a WELL-STOCKED first aid kit IN the shop. The kit is preferably sealed dust and watertight container and everything replaced after use (and check dates on labels and note them on OUTSIDE of container. I use a 12litre bucket for my kit (one you can turn upside-down when full of water and no leak). I have a list of the content of the bucket in a plastic pouch taped to the outside (not the lid it may get lost in the confusion) with expiration date and such clearly noted as well. Restocking is IMPORTANT. I keep two kits in the shop (just as the guru suggested). Major and small Injury kit (the small wound kit is just a canvas pouch with: tweezers, plasters, a small tube antiseptic creme). And I and NEVER open the Major Kit unless it really is a major injury (only happened once) or to refresh/check the content (don’t forget to change the date/content on the outside). I have "Treatment tags" (as pawpaw and US army call them). I printed them on my computer and have name: mine (preprinted together with my address, phone..) AND a line for that of the casualty, what happened (short two lines to write on) what I've done, and as Pawpaw said: pulse, respiration, pupil reaction, and extingusher data (if it was used), that is what separates the extinguisher and kit “tags”, the “kit tag’s” have no extinguisher data. I also have them 4 to a extinguisher and 10 to a first aid kit. each with a 2 foot string trough a hole in the corner of the paper. And the papers in a plastic pouch taped to the kit(inside)/extinguisher to keep it as clean as possible, oh and a PENCIL to each Kit/extinguisher. Not a pen or ballpoint, they tend to dry or freeze up or be dry when you most need them, a pencil always works but might get erased (use a medium hard lead and press some, that cures most of the problem). Make sure that the note follows that person to the emergency room, Ie tie it to a arm or a leg not clothing (thanks pawpaw, almost didn’t think of mentioning that). the reason why i have extinguisher data is thatif you put out a fire on a person (or near) is that Some treatments are hampered by certain chemicals in the extinguisherand other chemicals in them are harmful/caustic/poisonous... OErjan out for now. sorry for the HUGE badly edited post. OErjan -- pokerbacken at angelfire.com - Wednesday, 11/29/00 20:21:50 GMT > pawpaw I need help here) two scissor-like clamps, We call those Hemostats. I'd suggest a minimum of four pair. two each 4 inch, One straight and one curved, and two each i6 inch, one straight and one curved. Sticking plasters, we call Band Aids. One box of assorted, and one box of knuckle and finger tip. One of those masks to give mouth to mouth (probably has a name, pawpaw??), We call that a Pocket Mask. Mine is manufacutred by Laerdal. Reference the hot and cold packs. I keep them in metal boxes. Small cookie or candy tins. Otherwise they are subject to get crushed and activated in the kit and be worthless when you need them. Cling film is called either plastic wrap, or Saran wrap. It is also good for sealing a sucking chest wound. I use the "space blanket" instead of the wool blanket. Two reason, 1. it reflects back 95% of the body heat so is warme than the wool and 2. it's a disposable. Disposing of the old one and getting a new one lessons the chance for cross contamination. I also carry: 1 Cervical Collar size medium 1 inflateable leg splint, lower leg 1 inflateable leg splint, full leg 1 inflateable arm splint, forearm 1 inflateable arm splint, full arm 1 inflateable ankle brace The inflateable splints should be used ONLY by qualified personnel. If you inflate them too much, you can cut off blood flow and cause problems in addition to the already broken bone. Gangrene for example. In my earlier post in listed a IV kit. I have used the saline for washing out eyes and wounds both. It's sterile, it's well packed, and it's replaceable. I carry three rolls of adhesive tape in different widths. I also carry what we call "Kling Wrap". It's a stretchable guaze that klings to itself. Very handy for wounds that can't be TIGHTLY bandaged. I also carry several ACE bandages for wrapping minor sprians. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Wednesday, 11/29/00 20:55:39 GMT I'm sure Paw-Paw knows this but those inflatable full leg splints are also great for the treatment of shock. It keeps the blood in the upper part of the body where it's needed. kid -- xxx - Thursday, 11/30/00 01:13:01 GMT Kid, You're right and it's a point I should have mentioned. But i've always been leery of their use since I saw a guy lose a leg because of one. (no, I wasn't directly involved in the case) Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Thursday, 11/30/00 01:26:54 GMT I keep a 5 gallon metal bucket of clean water by the forge when there is fire in the pot. Good for a lot of things, feet when a piece of hot steel gets into a shoe, small fires on the floor outside the firepot, quick burn relief, etc. When I finish, I move (shovel) the fire out of the pot and into the bucket of water. I sleep very well at night, knowing that I have 2 inches of water over top of anything that once was hot. My grandfather had a truck horn that ran off electric in his shop, activated by a pull string. He said that if he got hurt, he wanted everyone to know, and to come running. That type alarm is very effective, and blows till someone shuts it off. Jim, Wal-mart sells pure 100% aloe gel. 24 oz for about $5.00 I have a heck of a time remembering to water the plants. As for tools, IF you feel the need to caution someone else before they use it, just how safe is it anyway ? It's more fun to forge, than to recover form an injury. Ntech -- Ntech at mindspring.com - Thursday, 11/30/00 02:33:23 GMT DAN DREYER? anyone got a new e-mail address for Dan? His old one dand at livegrip.com does not work anymore. Thanks Plain ol "Bill" -- wcottr at att.net - Thursday, 11/30/00 15:57:12 GMT Hello, I am just checking to see if anyone near vermont has a anvil for sale. I am not to picky about size just yet as i am just starting out and would consider anything thanks. lee Lee Underwood -- fusion at vermontel.net - Friday, 12/01/00 00:55:27 GMT Hello, I am just checking to see if anyone near vermont has a anvil for sale. I am not to picky about size just yet as i am just starting out and would consider anything thanks. lee Lee Underwood -- fusion at vermontel.net - Friday, 12/01/00 00:57:13 GMT Charcoal Making, Here is a site with lots of info on making charcoal and smelting. WWW.artrans.com/rmsg/indust/charcoal.htm (cut and paste)(I hope this isn't wrong to put here, if it is please delete it and assume I'm sorry.) Ok, for you guys looking for blowers I just finished the second model of my hand-crank bench grinder conversion into a blower. I made the whole thing for less than $10 U.S. I took a flea market hand crank grinder, used a cookie tin for the shroud and made a fan by taking a piece of 8" dia. x 2 1/2 wood and cutting slots across the face of it to make the vanes. It has 10 vanes slightly curved in the direction of the airflow ( don't know if it helps,but it looks good) and 2" square tubing stepped down to 1 1/4 dia to fit my home made forge. The grinder has a 15 to 1 ratio and is so smooth that the weight of the handle will make it turn down. It blows real good! I see those old grinders at garage sales and flea markets for sale from $5 to $20, and I have seen them advertised for sale new for $40 or so. Buy a old one, make a fan and shroud hook it up and forge! Talking about smouldering clothes, remember the Falklands war? I believe a lot of high up military people (and some unfortunate real people too) got some education about what NOT to wear in a fire. I read that when the exocet missle hit that british ship and it caught fire (Gee, aluminum burns!) a number of sailors received burns much worst than expected because they were wearing high tech polyester long underwear. The polyester melted right into their skin and did terrible damage. I hope the people in charge have gone back to wool and gotten rid of the plastic. I remember as a kid getting some burning plastic (Od green army man)on the back of my hand, Dang! I still can see the scar if I look hard enough. So don't wear your polyester leisure suit when you are doing any forging, no matter how tempting. Jim (moldy) Jordan -- njordan at epud.net.nospam - Friday, 12/01/00 06:58:41 GMT Jim: No matter how tempted I am to still don my leisure suit and forge, I’ll avoid it at all cost in the future. Good advise for novice blacksmiths anywhere. Wearing ones leisure suit at the forge would ad new meaning to, "burn baby burn disco inferno". Bruce R. Wallace -- service at nazel.com - Friday, 12/01/00 20:08:01 GMT All, Ntech mentioned something to me that I think we should consider. When we've finished the safety discussion that is currently underway, and Jock has made the safety article up, we might want to have a discussion about shop safety. What we've been taking about is personal safety. But some things that we might consider on the shop safety subject are; "proper" storage of flamiable liquids (gasoline, Kerosene, Thinners, etc) in and around the shop. Just what is the proper distance for a 5 gallon container of gas to be placed away from an open fire? Are the plastic store bought containers safe? Would a hot piece of iron (API round) be able to melt it's way through and ignite the liquid? Are the grinding wheel sparks enough fire to set a container on fire? Is 6' enough distance for the gas tanks Oxy/Ac to be away from a gas forge ? And what about that can of gasoline under the bench where the grinder sparks sometimes hit? Mostof us keep a can of lawn mower gas in the garage at home. Do all of the machines we use, particularly wire wheels?, have all opf the guards installed? (wry grin) Something to think about. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Friday, 12/01/00 23:34:17 GMT Here comes a further edited list with yet more additions, comments... from this forum. Yes it will be edited even further as to paragraphs, sentences... as pointed out by mail. Spelling is now checked (with Websters Eng/Swe dictionary so spelling is British English). Any comments on the content?? I still would like it to list some English first aid manuals/courses (I'll add Swedish ones later) be cruel to me it might save lives later. rather: point mistakes out and give your alternative and the reason for it. Here goes first aid: Just to start I want to say that we all should have CPR / Blocked airway training, and basic first aid training as said earlier (thanks Steve O'Grady for pointing it out). I recommend a course in first aid and a WELL-STOCKED first aid kit IN the shop (see below). Generally if you prepare you increase survivability, in a "situation" you will most likely react better if prepared, to take an example the “tags” are one small but vital thing in some situations (se below). 3 large trauma dressings (I think it is what pawpaw called military style. First Aid, Individual Dressing), 3pcs of elastic and regular gauze (10’ by3”), Paracetamol AND salicylic acid (some people are allergic to one or the other, so ask), Tweezers (two), eye wash WITH CUP, Scissors: 3 different: one straight, one curved and a heavy duty (for jeans, boots...), Plastic gloves, 1 Cervical Collar size medium 4 haemostats, 2 X 6”(150mm) curved and straight, 2 x 4”(100mm) curved and straight, 3 rolls of adhesive tape in different widths, Several ACE bandages for wrapping minor sprains. "Cling Wrap". It's stretchable gauze that clings to itself. Very handy for wounds that can't be TIGHTLY bandaged. OE: Like throat wounds and some chest wounds.... Sunburn lotion, Antiseptic solution (only to be used when CLEAN water and soap are not an option), stickingplasters, pawpaw: we call them Band-Aids. One box of assorted and one box of knuckle and finger tip. OE: One of those masks to give mouth to mouth pawpaw: We call that a Pocket Mask. A BUNCH (about ten each) of 3x3 and 4x4 gauze, Cling film *(same that you use for food), pawpaw: Cling film is called either plastic wrap, or Saran wrap. A small flashlight (I prefer a Quality one like a maglite, MityLite, Sabrelite or similar they tend to work when needed), Some duct tape (good for so much that it is in ALL my toolboxes, first aid kits...) And lastly a good SHARP knife. 95%of the case it is used to cut things like seatbelts, rope, clothing... to free a person, just be careful so you dot make things worse. Have a few of the chemical hot packs and a few of the chemical cold packs, I added the “several” as I live far north and cold is a KILLER... (Thanks pawpaw will ad these ASAP). The cold packs are good on bruises and burns here we have ice/snow 7months of the year so... not that much of a priority, will add a few though, never hurts and is no great expense. Pawpaw: I keep them in metal boxes. Small cookie or candy tins. Otherwise they are subject to get crushed and activated in the kit and be worthless when you need them. OE: good idea. As I have a hard padded container (padding is wool blanket folded so it lines the bucket on the sides) *The Clingfilm is to wrap burns with to prevent contamination and dehydration. Burns are mostly to be considered sterile (if not touched by someone with unwashed hands or otherwise contaminated). Just remove LARGE particles and then wrap, let the doctors take care of the small stuff and treatment. On chemical burns you can’t do this but must rinse in water as long as possible instead. It only works on heat burns past the “sunburn stage”. Pawpaw: It is also good for sealing a sucking chest wound. I also have a Wool blanket. Wool as it is both warm (even when damp) AND “fireproof” for short periods of time so you can extinguish fires on persons with it and afterwards keep the person warm (wont smell nice after the fire but...), I recommend a course in first aid and a WELL-STOCKED first aid kit IN the shop. The kit is preferably sealed dust and watertight container and everything replaced after use (and check dates on labels and note them on OUTSIDE of container. I use a 12litre bucket for my kit (one you can turn upside-down when full of water and no leak). I have a list of the content of the bucket in a plastic pouch taped to the outside (not the lid it may get lost in the confusion) with expiration date and such clearly noted as well. Restocking is IMPORTANT. I keep two kits in the shop (just as the guru suggested). Major and small Injury kit (the small wound kit is just a canvas pouch with: tweezers, plasters, a small tube antiseptic creme). And I and NEVER open the Major Kit unless it really is a major injury (only happened once) or to refresh/check the content (don’t forget to change the date/content on the outside). I have "Treatment tags" (as pawpaw and US army call them). I printed them on my computer and have name: mine (preprinted together with my address, phone..) AND a line for that of the casualty, what happened (short two lines to write on) what I've done, and as Pawpaw said: pulse, respiration, pupil reaction, and extingusher data (if it was used), that is what separates the extinguisher and kit “tags”, the “kit tag’s” have no extinguisher data. I also have them 4 to a extinguisher and 10 to a first aid kit. each with a 2 foot string trough a hole in the corner of the paper. And the papers in a plastic pouch taped to the kit(inside)/extinguisher to keep it as clean as possible, oh and a PENCIL to each Kit/extinguisher. Not a pen or ballpoint, they tend to dry or freeze up or be dry when you most need them, a pencil always works but might get erased (use a medium hard lead and press some, that cures most of the problem). Make sure that the note follows that person to the emergency room, Ie tie it to a arm or a leg not clothing (thanks pawpaw, almost didn’t think of mentioning that). the reason why I have extinguisher data is thatif you put out a fire on a person (or near) is that Some treatments are hampered by certain chemicals in the extinguisherand other chemicals in them are harmful/caustic/poisonous... sorry for a even larger posing. OErjan -- pokerbacken at angelfire.com - Saturday, 12/02/00 21:45:57 GMT You men have done us a real service with these 1st aid/safety suggestions. I have allowed my skills and aid bag to deteriorate over time. This has helped me get squared away again as well as alert my employer to some very obvious deficiencies in our operation. We will be utilizing these basic guidelines as a pattern to develop from. Thank you. Mills -- mills_fam2 at netzero.net - Sunday, 12/03/00 01:50:15 GMT Mills, You just made my day, fella! THANKS for the feedback! Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Sunday, 12/03/00 02:00:35 GMT He could sombody send me detailed plans for a charcoal forge thanks Justin Hall -- sk8erpunkjustin at hotmail.com - Sunday, 12/03/00 02:43:48 GMT Justin, Check out the GETTING STARTED article, the Plans page, and the 21st Century Page. Only real difference between a Coal forge and a Charcoal forge is the depth of the fire pot. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at pawpaws-forge.com - Sunday, 12/03/00 04:14:50 GMT Greetings all. I am just starting out with actual hammering, and was wondering if anyone could suggest a good tool supplier. I'm looking for a planishing hammer, and the like. If anyone has any info, please let me know. Thanks Dave Dave -- TheDrkRavn at aol.com - Sunday, 12/03/00 07:39:06 GMT Dave, I'll give you three choices in alphabetical order. Take your pick. Centaur Forge Kayne and Son Wall Metal All three have links on our links page. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Sunday, 12/03/00 13:59:52 GMT One thing I think is pretty important that should be included in the safety list (imHo) is a pair of eye patches, one of which has a small hole in it. I say a pair because if you get something in one eye, but still need to see, even if it's just to get to the car, wearing one patch with a hole over the good eye will imobilize both eyes and keep you from doing more damage. Try it, instead of moving your eyes, you'll turn your head and use the hole to see at least a little. (American Red Cross training from years ago) Moldy Moldy Jim -- If you need it ask. - Sunday, 12/03/00 18:27:47 GMT Moldy: People shooting pistol use the devise, It works, but you loose depth perception, peripheral vision and LOTS of light. To immobilise the eye the hole must be less than 3mm (~1/8") half pupil diameter MAX (and max pupil is around 7mm~9/32”). At 3mm (1/8”) you need ~40%more light than normal, Loose 95%of field of vision. And have 6-9times harder to judge distances. That is NOT something to drive around in a car with. It stops you hurting your eyes but might kill you on your way to get help. B.tw if you have glasses you can use that to compensate some of the sight loss if they are lost and you need to read. A diopter (what the devise is called) can make up to 1.6 but around there you need 5 times the light just to read. A diopter helped a friend when he broke his reading glasses and had to read a map to get home, he made a hole in a piece of plastic and used that... You might not need that patch if you use proper safety glasses/face-shields... might get hurt away from shop though... and as I always try to be prepared (Praeparatus supervivet ~ the prepared survives. Latin proverb) i might include them. OErjan -- pokerbacken at angelfire.com - Sunday, 12/03/00 20:03:23 GMT Moldy: sorry if I sounded patronising, didn't mean to be so harsh. just meant to point out the down side of diopters. OE -- same - Sunday, 12/03/00 20:09:31 GMT Does anyone know a supplier of leather for making a bellows. I have started building one and am having a difficult time locating a source for the leather. Would the kind of covering found on restaurant benches be okay to use? John Nash -- trkrjnash at aol.com - Sunday, 12/03/00 23:03:44 GMT John, If you can catch and skin enough Nuaga's nuagahide should work! (grin) OK, OK, I know it's a bad joke! but I just couldn't pass it up! Try Tandy Leather at: http://www.tandyleather.com/ PPW Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Monday, 12/04/00 02:37:03 GMT Hello, I recently came across a pile of old metal rims off of the wooden wheels of old horse drawn wagons. They are a bit rusted but thick and look usable. Any idea what sort of metal these are made of? I'm a beginner and any thought would help. Mark Labhart labhart -- mlabhart at indiana.edu - Monday, 12/04/00 02:39:22 GMT Has anyone heard of using stuff called "glazing putty" for filling cracks and/or grinding marks and grooves? If so, where might I find some? Steve Stransky -- Slstransky at cs.com - Monday, 12/04/00 03:55:59 GMT looking for plans on a morgan forge - anyone know where to get them? savvyhunter -- blacksmith at somewhatreal.com - Monday, 12/04/00 04:16:23 GMT looking for plans on a morgan forge - anyone know where to get them? savvyhunter -- blacksmith at somewhatreal.com - Monday, 12/04/00 04:18:16 GMT looking for plans on a morgan forge - anyone know where to get them? savvyhunter -- blacksmith at somewhatreal.com - Monday, 12/04/00 04:18:37 GMT Jeepers OErjan, I didn't mean for you to drive the car with two eye patches on! (Although the way some people drive around here it probably couldn't hurt!) ;-) What I meant to say is to use the eye patch to hold both eyes still while you get to help or it comes to you. I know from experience that if you get something in your eye, just walking to the sink you will try to track your eyes on movement. It's nearly impossible to walk and not move your eyes. Even with glasses etc. on, small chips and bits can bounce behind your glasses and enter your eyes. (and I won't believe you if you say it hasn't happen to every one of us at some time or another.) On the rare ocassions when a small bit gets in my eye, I will hold a finger up in front of my eye and stare at it, then by using my perifral (side) vision I can at least walk to the first aid kit to wash it out without causing more damage by scraping it across my eye. By no means would I recommend you try to treat major injuries yourself, I was talking about minor chips, and things that do not warrent an ambulance ride. But to even get to the hospital for serious damage you will have to be transported, and the hole in the patch will fix your eye in one position while you are are moved. In fact, just sitting in a car (being driven by someone else) with the patches on both eyes it will help keep the pain from making you do more damage to yourself. Humans are visual animals and it is hard to keep from moving our eyes constantly, even when it can cause pain. So I stick by my recommendation, keeping in mind the limitations and hazards of doing so. (Will you still be my friend? he says sheepishly.) Ole Moldy One Eye. Moldy -- Yikes! - Monday, 12/04/00 06:57:02 GMT Upcoming Events, Eastern Pennsylvanis, December 9th, 15th & 16th: I visited the National Parks Service Hopewell site and Joanna Furnace, as related on the Guru page. This looks like fun to me: Hopewell Furnace will host its Iron Plantation Christmas on Saturday, December 9th. One of their volunteers will have the forge up and running, doing demonstrations. (See links page) The Hay Creek Valley Historical Association will be hosting Christmas at Joanna on Friday and Saturday nights, December 15 and 16, from 6:00 to 9:00 p.m., complete with carolers and candlelight. (www.haycreek.org) These are wonderful sites, and certainly worth a visit and our support. Bruce Blackistone (Atli) -- asylum at us.HSAnet.net - Monday, 12/04/00 11:10:45 GMT Steve, Glazier's putty can be picked up at almost any hardware store. But be advised that Glazier's putty is just talcum powder or chalk powder mixed with linseed oil or cotton oil. It'll probably fill the grinding marks and grooves, but it won't hold up very well. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Monday, 12/04/00 14:39:37 GMT CONNECTICUT BLACKSMITH GUILD: http://www.abana-chapter.com/CT/index.htm This ABANA chapter has fallen on hard times membership wise and needs NEW members and OLD members. They are holding a meeting January 21st to at Mystic Seaport to try to reestablish the chapter. Click the above URL for more information. We get a lot of folks from the New England area looking for chapters. Here is your chance! You don't have to be a blacksmith. Just interested in the craft. Chapter meetings are great fun, you get to meet other NICE folks that are as crazy as you are, see iron pounding and maybe do some yourself. Please bring safety glasses! Jock D. -- guru at anvilfire.com - Monday, 12/04/00 16:41:53 GMT GLAZING PUTTY: This is an automotive finishing product. Its just thick primer. It shrinks too much so I never use it. I spot prime (spray) with black HSS Dupont Primer. The problem is this is only available in gallons now. The black high speed sanding primer is the best. All finishing primers should be applied after the surface has been preped for painting (clean, sandblasted). Spot putty like glazing putty should be applied over primer. If the piece has been cold galvanized for outdoor use and places that are sanded should be touched up with cold galvanizing (zinc powder paint) and then reprimed. Jock D. -- guru at anvilfire.com - Monday, 12/04/00 16:49:23 GMT Paints and putties: They above mentioned primer is a lacquer based product. You can apply enamel (most brushing paints) over lacquer but you CANNOT use lacquer over enamel or other finishes. The lacquer softens and reacts with the other finishes and make a HUGE mess. If the finishing you are speaking of is on wrought iron work the bare metal should be finished. Future paint jobs will not putty and touch up. Flap wheels do a good job of smoothing coarser grinding marks. Jock D. -- guru at anvilfire.com - Monday, 12/04/00 17:01:34 GMT Bellows: why use leather? I used some *heavy* treated canvas for my large double action bellows. Got it as scrap from a tarp/awning company that made wind "shields" for oil drilling rigs. Still using it about 20 years later... Biringuccio mentions canvas sided bellows in "Pirotechnic" IIRC. Nauga is a plastic and has nasty melting/burning properties. But it should work. Real leather is expensive! make sure you get something that can take the flex and not come apart. Charcoal forges: one other difference: they take a lot less umph on the blower or bellows to come to heat. As for "detailed plans" dig a hole, run a pipe to bottom of hole. direct output of blowdryer into pipe. Done! Or: take heavy metal door to WWII horizontal boaring machine. Weld pipes to hold legs on corners. Bend pipe legs and install into corner pipes. Cut circular hole about 1/3 the distance longways and 1/2 the distance side to side. Drop 1937 banjo rearend axel housing into hole: (but first remove bearing and grind interior smooth) weld pipe into the side of the axel housing for blower/bellows to connect to. Put sliding cover on lower end of housing. place castiron drain grate or hose faucet handle or piece of expanded steel over hole in top of axel housing. Forge. This is my primary travel forge and I'm having a lot of run building accessorys for it, tool rack, hammer rack, chisel bin, water pot, adjustable cross pieces to contain the fire--usefull for charcoal to make it less wide but deeper. The basic directions are: use what you got; tinker till you're happy! Thomas Thomas Powers -- thomas_powers at my-deja.com - Monday, 12/04/00 18:43:33 GMT Moldy: sure I'll be a friend if you wish. and yes it has hapened to me. Had to remove a chip surgically... it burned onto the eye. I closed my eyes and walked slowly trying to "stare" straight ahead tru my eyelids. most people can get around rather well without vision in familiar places, ever gone to the bathroom at night witout puting on the light so other half could sleep undisturbed??(better than alternative. no Ralph, not a fryingpan ;-) ) "Thomas Powers: Charcoal forges: one other difference: they take a lot less umph on the blower or bellows to come to heat." OE: agree completly. OErjan -- pokerbacken at angelfire.com - Monday, 12/04/00 19:28:14 GMT Blacksmith Dudes, OErjan, Had that eye surgery Too, Using a hand grinder in close quarters. Had to go without safety gogs. The Doc did it with me awake, and eyes open!!! "Stick a needle in my eye"!!! This brings me to my real point. I need an anvil. One that isnt junk. And one that isnt expensive. By that i mean I wont pay more for one that you wouldnt. Yea i can buy one If i shell out 2x the going rate. Im a newbie, but Im not a sucker. So dont Email me with expensive junk. I can get scrap steel for $.05 a pound all day long. I dont need a door stop. So please help me. Im in ohio and can handle In. or Pa. Thank you, And God Bless America. Scott . Scott -- Scott_wojtasik at hotmail.com - Monday, 12/04/00 23:24:29 GMT Blacksmith Dudes, OErjan, Had that eye surgery Too, Using a hand grinder in close quarters. Had to go without safety gogs. The Doc did it with me awake, and eyes open!!! "Stick a needle in my eye"!!! This brings me to my real point. I need an anvil. One that isnt junk. And one that isnt expensive. By that i mean I wont pay more for one that you wouldnt. Yea i can buy one If i shell out 2x the going rate. Im a newbie, but Im not a sucker. So dont Email me with expensive junk. I can get scrap steel for $.05 a pound all day long. I dont need a door stop. So please help me. Im in ohio and can handle In. or Pa. Thank you, And God Bless America. Scott . Scott -- Scott_wojtasik at hotmail.com - Monday, 12/04/00 23:25:23 GMT Scott; where in Ohio? Met a fellow in Springfield who had a bunch of anvils for $2 a pound---left his cards at the SOFA meeting cause that's too high for me. Same fleamarket I met him at I chated with a fellow and he said he had about 100-150# anvil with tooling for $100----if his cousin didn't want it. I left my name and number so I might have an extra anvil if that pans out. Put up a card at the local farmer's co-op; talk to people at fleamarkets---anvils don't usually make it to them cause they are heavy! *Ask* folk with "barn junk" if they have an anvil back at the place. If you are not too far from Columbus the next meeting of the MOB (Mid Ohio Blacksmiths) will be Saturday Dec 16 at 5pm. Thomas Powers MOBster Thomas Powers -- thomas_powers at my-deja.com - Tuesday, 12/05/00 16:19:53 GMT I am looking for info on small gas forges, on the order of the Whisper Daddy 3 burner and a Mankel 3 burner, I amy realatively new to the internet and to balcksmithing although have a great art backround..I left message at the chat room also. Jed -- havenhomes at netwurx.net - Wednesday, 12/06/00 00:55:40 GMT Bruce, Looking forward to your call, anytime, if no answer I am probably here. (only one line). I will be demonstrating at an Open Air German Christmas market on Dec. 7,8,and 9. If you can make it I will show you arround the "Buggy Museum " here in town. Stay warm in Harrisburg. Bob Clark -- rechamer at uplink.net - Wednesday, 12/06/00 03:36:53 GMT anybody know when the next few BAM (that's missouri) meets are? couldn't find a page that was up and running and it's too late to make phone calls. thanks, m mark s. krause -- kbmk13 at prodigy.net - Wednesday, 12/06/00 03:54:25 GMT I need to build a gas forge sometime before summer. Does anyone know of a place in or around the Dallas/Fort Worth Metroplex where I could have one of my siblings pick up some kaowool, ITC-100, and kiln shelving? Stormcrow -- jbhelm at worldnet.att.netSPAMISBAD - Thursday, 12/07/00 03:40:30 GMT I have 3 Blowers with motors that are surplus. Possibly more haven't got to the bottom of the pile yet. They are 2 HP 110/220 electric motors. They are hazardous location rated but they do not work, and have been outside for various lengths of time. It is my job to move them any way possible. Easiest method will be to offer them to a motor shop but perhaps someone in this forum would have a use for something like this. If interested contact me at: lmills at envirot.com (405)488-2400 0800-1700 (nominally)CST ask for Mills or fax (405)488-2404 I must take action NLT Friday 8 Dec Just for Grins we also have 2" & 4" flanged glass pipe in 4' lengths that I must dispose of as well. Anybody for a heat and beat treat? :) Mills -- mills_fam2 at netzero.net - Thursday, 12/07/00 04:50:41 GMT Anybody know anything about an "American Novelty" triphammer? I'm tracking on a couple of them and would like a better idea of what "type" they are. Thomas Thomas Powers -- thomas_powers at my-deja.com - Thursday, 12/07/00 14:51:24 GMT "THE BOSS" is the name of hammers sold by American Novelty Ironworks. It had a distinctive tubular frame and was shipped broken down. The linkage was of the bowspring design. They were popular for a brief period in the early 1900's Jock D. -- guru at anvilfire.com - Thursday, 12/07/00 22:56:49 GMT BAM: Their website has been down for a while. I will ask about it again. Jock D. -- guru at anvilfire.com - Thursday, 12/07/00 22:59:28 GMT HELLO, I AM LOOKING FOR AN AIR HAMMER AND I WANT TO KNOW IF ANYONE HAVE HAS ANY FOR SALE, CATEGORY OF NASEL 2 AND 3. Heriberto Lopez -- NOEMIS at msn.com - Saturday, 12/09/00 21:19:09 GMT The next B.A.M. meeting will be at the Bass Pro shop in Nixa (just south of Springfield on Hwy. 160, turn west on Kathryn St. at the Allied Bus building) on Jan. 20. Things start up about 8 or 9 a.m. Hope to see ya. Fred -- jweisenb at llion.org - Sunday, 12/10/00 02:50:36 GMT Heriberto, Contact Bruce Wallace of Wall Metal. Link on the links page, and also on the banner ad on the top of this page. Bruce deals in several different makes of hammer and will do an honest deal for you. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Sunday, 12/10/00 03:49:20 GMT HELLO HELLO BRI - Tuesday, 12/12/00 03:38:12 GMT Alright! Bill, Your Art gallery would be excellent for people like me who would like to display some of thier humble products. Thx Alot! ColdForge - Tuesday, 12/12/00 19:52:34 GMT I am going to weld a front end axel for a huber tractor that i have it was made around 1920 & is made out of cast. Before i fire up the forge anybody know of any special problems with this age of cast? william glass -- bglass at grogon.com - Wednesday, 12/13/00 00:36:47 GMT ColdForge I don't think anyone has suggested this to you, but a very good way to learn a lot is to find your local Abana chapter and join. Most if not all of them will let you come to a few meetings to see if it interests you before you have to join. The cost is not that much for most chapters. Also go to your local library and check out every book on blacksmithing that they have. JNewman -- newmanj at attglobal.net - Wednesday, 12/13/00 00:47:32 GMT How Are all you hammer boys doing? I'm a knife maker and I found a large bar of steel had it tested.C.38 Mn.77 P.013 S.022 Si.24 Cu.20 Ni 1.86 Cr.85 Mo.22 v.005 Cb.004 Al.026 Can any one tell me if I can fold this with 01 or 1095? the cemist called it 4340 I call it 2240. Ron Maurin -- rockwell65c at earthlink.net - Wednesday, 12/13/00 01:19:00 GMT How Are all you hammer boys doing? I'm a knife maker and I found a large bar of steel had it tested.C.38 Mn.77 P.013 S.022 Si.24 Cu.20 Ni 1.86 Cr.85 Mo.22 v.005 Cb.004 Al.026 Can any one tell me if I can fold this with 01 or 1095? the cemist called it 4340 I call it 2240. Ron Maurin -- rockwell65c at earthlink.net - Wednesday, 12/13/00 01:20:04 GMT does anyone else have a problem with their slack tubs freezing solid this time of year? i've tried using brine solution. this helps somewhat. any other ideas out there? coondogger -- onehorse at mediaone.net - Wednesday, 12/13/00 20:20:20 GMT Coondogger - Salt will affect how quickly the water quenches the steel. Brine cools more quickly than water because it boils at a higher temp. so the steel contacts the qunchant for a longer amount of time. I don't know just how much it affects it since I've never tried it and am rather inexperienced, but I do know that I've read that in many different places. Stormcrow - Thursday, 12/14/00 00:32:06 GMT hi all chris -- zertwiz at aol.com - Thursday, 12/14/00 06:09:14 GMT hi all chris -- zertwiz at aol.com - Thursday, 12/14/00 06:09:44 GMT Hi, Chris! Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Thursday, 12/14/00 14:48:30 GMT Coondogger, I've had the same problem, blown the bottom our of a couple of drums that way! I put some antifreeze in my barrel this year and it seems to work just fine, I get some slush at the top but it hasn't frozen yet. a plus seems to be the corrosion inhibitors in it cuts down on rusting if your work isn't finished soon! Mike Mike Roth -- emeraldisleforge at emeraldisle.com - Thursday, 12/14/00 16:13:01 GMT Coondogger and Mike, I use a stock tank heater in my tub ( 55 gallon barrel ). 1500 watt. Does the trick. It's been 9º below so far this year. In the past, I've just had a 30 gallon barrel, and used a magnetic block heater ( with some success ). The wooden 1/2 barrel I used years ago froze and blew the bottom out. Superquench will freeze ( but not solid ). Stir it occasionally. The anti freeze deal sounds interesting. Might even get some color in the quench. Steve O'Grady -- lforge at netins.net - Thursday, 12/14/00 19:15:48 GMT I'm sure you guys have heard this before, but remember antifreeze is poisonous to any critters that may drink out of the slack tub! Plus i don't think the fumes are very pleasant, either... Alan L -- longmire at premiernet.net - Thursday, 12/14/00 19:52:04 GMT mike, one of my dogs has a habit of drinking from my slack tub. so, to alan L's point, that rules out antifreeze. steve, the problem with the stock tank heaters is they require electricity and my smithy is not wired. i use lanterns for light in the evening. coondogger -- onehorse at mediaone.net - Thursday, 12/14/00 21:07:11 GMT Mike, I have seen references to putting a 2x4 sticking up out of the slack tub helps, don't know why. Mid Willamette valley seldom get cold long enough to cause freezing. How about insulating it really good, so each time you use it you cover it up to conserve the heat from use? It may not be an option, but how about hooking up a hose to it and letting it trickle constantly? Ofg course you would need to run a pipe or drain of some kind. Moldy Moldy -- sorry - Thursday, 12/14/00 22:53:59 GMT To all, Found a good source for 4140 last week. Large bar stock 4" X 6". $.60/lb. Good for power hammer dies, tooling, etc...Alameda Machine Oakland Ca, ask for Ron, tell him I sent you. questions, email me. Tim Tim Cisneros -- blacksmith at theforgeworks.com - Friday, 12/15/00 15:28:36 GMT coondogger, you may just have to dump the water out after each day of forging? or keep a propane heater in the shop the night before you plan on smithing. Hope that helps. Steve C Steve C -- coolcrabster at aol.com - Sunday, 12/17/00 17:11:59 GMT coondogger, you may just have to dump the water out after each day of forging? or keep a propane heater in the shop the night before you plan on smithing. Hope that helps. Steve C Steve C -- coolcrabster at aol.com - Sunday, 12/17/00 17:12:22 GMT I've never done this before, just want to read what peopel are saying right now and maybe put my two cents in as things come up Kennen -- kennen at quantium.net - Sunday, 12/17/00 22:38:33 GMT I've never done this before, just want to read what peopel are saying right now and maybe put my two cents in as things come up Kennen -- kennen at quantium.net - Sunday, 12/17/00 22:39:07 GMT I've never done this before, just want to read what peopel are saying right now and maybe put my two cents in as things come up Kennen -- kennen at quantium.net - Sunday, 12/17/00 22:43:34 GMT Am lookin' 4 suggestions on a donor vehicle, tool, or piece of equipment that would have an air cylinder usable on my current project building an air hammer capable of a 35-50 lb anvil. Am pretty well set on goin' with air instead of electric or treadle. Any advice and suggestions greatly appreciated. I'm living in Western KY (Paducah)Was in a scooter wreck back in '88 that left me with a paralyzed right arm. Merry XMas All . . . Roosta Roosta -- mafe at apex.net - Monday, 12/18/00 12:36:35 GMT Kennen, Welcome to the wonderful world of blacksmithing! Roosta, Rough break, but glad to see you didn't give up! I'm gonna refer your question to the guru, he may have some ideas for you. Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Monday, 12/18/00 13:30:18 GMT Frozen slack tub. Yeah, kinda depressing. Have you considered brine? The freezing point of a saturated salt solution is -6 F (-21 C) At least the critters shouldn't over do enough to hurt em. Eats up steel tanks though. Now you want depressing. . . ice in the toilet bowl. Had that during a couple power outages. . . Jock D. -- guru at anvilfire.com - Monday, 12/18/00 14:22:41 GMT AIR CYLINDERS are more difficult to find than hydraulic cylinders. Hydraulic cylinders are heavier and generaly more durable. However, in new ones in good condition the seals are too tight for an air hammer. Most have double seals. If it can be disassembled remove one seals. If its an old cylinder and moves freely by hand the seals are not too tight. Cylinders for air hammers should have a cushion or snubber. This is an internal air trap that softens the end of the stroke. However, in good hammer design you try to avoid hitting the end of the cylinder. A spring or external cushion is highly recommended. Normally these are needed on the UP stroke to stop the ram. I recommend a plate with springs and small shock absorbers. Remember that it is going to TRY to hit just as hard going UP as down unless your valving is just right. The shock/snubber should not need to work on every stroke. Try contacting your local ABANA Chapter. You will find folks there very helpful. With the popularity of air hammers the tail-gaters often find them (these guys are great to know). Try local industry. Tell them you are looking for new or used cylinders that they may not have use for. Take ALL sizes. Small cylinders can be setup on air-vises and clamping jigs. A horizontal gripping cylinder on your air hammer would be very useful (not just to you but to any smith). A lot of hammer work is done with hand held dies that get changed often. An air clamp would be a real handy trick. Many folks use clamp on die caps but this is more for higher production work or where you don't have a lot of rapid die changes. Jock D. -- guru at anvilfire.com - Monday, 12/18/00 14:44:55 GMT Roosta: Far as I know your nearest ABANA chapter would be either in Louisville or in St. Louis. Larry Zoeller in Louisville has made a few air hammers, look at his page. You can find it in the "links" page here. Alan L -- longmire at premiernet.net - Monday, 12/18/00 16:19:01 GMT Roosta: There is a bunch of people In the Illinois Valley Blacksmith Association that meet in Mt. Vernon IL fairly regularly. I think that is about 75 miles from you. The Ivba has a webpage at www.ivba.org. David White -- dwhite at siumed.edu - Monday, 12/18/00 17:32:55 GMT Roosta: There is a bunch of people In the Illinois Valley Blacksmith Association that meet in Mt. Vernon IL fairly regularly. I think that is about 75 miles from you. The Ivba has a webpage at www.ivba.org. David White -- dwhite at siumed.edu - Monday, 12/18/00 17:33:48 GMT For Sale: 50lb. Little Giant 3500.00, 3 Peter Wrights in the 200lb. range 450.00 each, 1 Peter Wright 168lb. 375.00. I recommend you call as I don't check e-mail often,618-867-2983 or 2323, Thanks Andrew Macdonald -- forge at dellnet.com - Tuesday, 12/19/00 05:46:17 GMT For Sale: 50lb. Little Giant 3500.00, 3 Peter Wrights in the 200lb. range 450.00 each, 1 Peter Wright 168lb. 375.00. I recommend you call as I don't check e-mail often,618-867-2983 or 2323, Thanks Andrew Macdonald -- forge at dellnet.com - Tuesday, 12/19/00 05:46:45 GMT I put salt in my slack tub to keep it from freezing. My slack tub was 1/2 of a wood whisky barrell. It didn't freeze but it did rust the bands in two in about a year. It also rusts up your tools and anything else made of iron that gets dripped on, other than that no problem. kid -- xxx - Wednesday, 12/20/00 01:04:55 GMT hi does anyone know where i can find a picture of the inside of a blacksmtih shop. I really need this please email me the website ALLISON -- A76ersGal at aol.com - Thursday, 12/21/00 00:49:06 GMT does anyone know where i can find information on the kind of tools and what a blacksmith shop looks like? please email me at the following address listed allison magan -- lfolover3212 at hotmail.com - Thursday, 12/21/00 00:53:27 GMT All, Peace on Earth, to Men of Good Will. Nannie & Paw Paw Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Saturday, 12/23/00 13:26:43 GMT Just want to say Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukah, Happy New Year and Happy any other celebration I might have left out. Thanks for all the help you've given us. Larry & Linda Blue Heron Forge Larry -- Blueheron419 - Sunday, 12/24/00 04:39:05 GMT Roosta, I built a Kinyon-style air hammer last year that I am very happy with. I used a hydraulic cylinder off of a front-end loader. It has a 125 lb. ram and gets approx. 180-200 beats/min. I used the Alabama Forge council schematic (highly recommended) The hammer can be viewed on my web site: www.theforgeworks.com (scroll down to "the shop") Good luck! Glad to help in any way I can. Tim Cisneros Tim Cisneros -- blacksmith at theforgeworks.com - Monday, 12/25/00 02:00:05 GMT What hight should I have the anvil at? What color should the chizel be tempered at for cutting stone? Harry Smith (blacksmith to the stars) -- Svenster2 at netscape.net - Tuesday, 12/26/00 16:32:42 GMT What hight should I have the anvil at? What color should the chizel be tempered at for cutting stone? Harry Smith (blacksmith to the stars) -- Svenster2 at netscape.net - Tuesday, 12/26/00 16:40:39 GMT I would like to announce the formation of a new organization dedicated to the older more learned members of our chosen profession/passion. It will be known as the Crusty Old Blacksmith Society (COBS). The charter stipulates that members of the society will set the standard of conduct for all to aspire to with keen insight and an acerbic manner when instructing younger, less informed individuals. Qualifications are that you must be one of the ancients, with at least a dim memory of the discovery of iron ore. As well one should have the countenance of a person who drinks vinegar or alum water. To this end we are opening the floor to discussion of charter members, honorary posts and most importantly .. The Charter President. Several have been considered for this post including Jock Dempsey and Cracked Anvil. However, the one who seems to most embody the spirit of the Society and my nomiination for this most auspicious position, is our very own Jim 'Paw Paw' Wilson. Any input from readers of this forum will be noted and discussed at our inaugural meeting, (which will be whenever we can get any two to agree on anything!). Thank you for your support. Mills COBS.I.T (in training) Mills -- Millsmail - Wednesday, 12/27/00 14:56:24 GMT I would like to announce the formation of a new organization dedicated to the older more learned members of our chosen profession/passion. It will be known as the Crusty Old Blacksmith Society (COBS). The charter stipulates that members of the society will set the standard of conduct for all to aspire to with keen insight and an acerbic manner when instructing younger, less informed individuals. Qualifications are that you must be one of the ancients, with at least a dim memory of the discovery of iron ore. As well one should have the countenance of a person who drinks vinegar or alum water. To this end we are opening the floor to discussion of charter members, honorary posts and most importantly .. The Charter President. Several have been considered for this post including Jock Dempsey and Cracked Anvil. However, the one who seems to most embody the spirit of the Society and my nomiination for this most auspicious position, is our very own Jim 'Paw Paw' Wilson. Any input from readers of this forum will be noted and discussed at our inaugural meeting, (which will be whenever we can get any two to agree on anything!). Thank you for your support. Mills COBS.I.T (in training) Mills -- Millsmail - Wednesday, 12/27/00 14:58:42 GMT I would like to announce the formation of a new organization dedicated to the older more learned members of our chosen profession/passion. It will be known as the Crusty Old Blacksmith Society (COBS). The charter stipulates that members of the society will set the standard of conduct for all to aspire to with keen insight and an acerbic manner when instructing younger, less informed individuals. Qualifications are that you must be one of the ancients, with at least a dim memory of the discovery of iron ore. As well one should have the countenance of a person who drinks vinegar or alum water. To this end we are opening the floor to discussion of charter members, honorary posts and most importantly .. The Charter President. Several have been considered for this post including Jock Dempsey and Cracked Anvil. However, the one who seems to most embody the spirit of the Society and my nomiination for this most auspicious position, is our very own Jim 'Paw Paw' Wilson. Any input from readers of this forum will be noted and discussed at our inaugural meeting, (which will be whenever we can get any two to agree on anything!). Thank you for your support. Mills COBS.I.T (in training) Mills -- Millsmail - Wednesday, 12/27/00 15:16:15 GMT Uh oh, I swear I only hit post one time. Mills -- ditto - Wednesday, 12/27/00 15:19:34 GMT Mills, WAIT! WHOA! What'd I do to deserve this (dubious) honor? I've been NICE to you! I haven't hollered at you for for for, well at LEAST a day or two... I think Jock would make a MUCH better Charter President than "I" would! Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Wednesday, 12/27/00 16:24:24 GMT Crusty, never except when it come to making bread. Old, not nearly as old as the others and NOT EVEN as old some think I am. I'm just well read (and practiced). Besides, We already have Cyber Smiths International. No officers yet but as cheif cook and bottle washer I have too many duties to take on any more. Now Paw-Paw. . He is rapidly approaching retirement age and has military organizational experiance and notheing better to do. . . Happy New Year ALL. Stay off the highways. Its too dang slipery out there! Jock D. -- guru at anvilfire.com - Wednesday, 12/27/00 16:43:08 GMT Jock! How about cracked anvil, then? He's a LOT more crusty than I am! Paw Paw Wilson -- pawpaw at paw-paws-forge.com - Thursday, 12/28/00 03:51:54 GMT I'm setting up to build a casting furnace and know a bit from reading around. But I can't seem to find any suppliers of refractory bricks, in town or online. One more thing, is there such a thing as a clay that is refractory once dried? Luke Sowa -- Lukesowa at hotmail.com - Thursday, 12/28/00 04:26:48 GMT Paw Paw I believe Cracked Anvil exhibits some of the finer characteristics that this Society needs in the inaugural stage, just refer to some of his postings! I do wonder though is he old enough? I admit he SEEMS to have been around since dirt, but has he really? Any way we could clear this up? Cracked, your input please. Mills -- lmills at envirot.com - Thursday, 12/28/00 19:25:30 GMT Luke, Have you checked clay & ceramic supplies? Most places have some kind of hobby supplier for ceramics of some sort. Check out near universities and arty type schools. In Oregon there are a couple of different chain type craft stores that have some stuff. Look around some more, you'll find some closer than you think. A.J.Bartells is one refractory supplier that may be on the web. You might even try your local brick and cement supplier, they may carry fire brick for fireplaces, or be able to aim you to a supplier. Almost any clay can be used as a refractory, there are some guys on another forum that are using Adobe clay or even the old pure clay kitty litter/oil absorbant as forge linings. Good luck. Moldy Moldy -- sorry - Friday, 12/29/00 07:12:08 GMT I am looking for information on 18th and 19th century blacksmithing. What their shops looked like, tools, forges, their dress, what they made, etc. Bob Schlag -- rschlag at eagnet.com - Friday, 12/29/00 12:55:46 GMT I am looking for a treadle hammer that has interchangeable heads. New or used. Bob Schlag -- rschlag at eagnet.com - Friday, 12/29/00 13:00:15 GMT Luke, I got my fire brick at a local refractory contractor who also sells the bricks they use. This stuff insulating fire brick, which is not the same as fireplace bricks. It's much lighter and cuts easily with a fine-toothed saw. I've been told that regular fireplace brick is more of a heat-sink than an insulator. Look under refractories in your yellow pages. Good luck. -Marc Marc -- takeahike at mediaone.net - Sunday, 12/31/00 19:17:21 GMT Luke, I got my fire brick at a local refractory contractor who also sells the bricks they use. This stuff insulating fire brick, which is not the same as fireplace bricks. It's much lighter and cuts easily with a fine-toothed saw. I've been told that regular fireplace brick is more of a heat-sink than an insulator. Look under refractories in your yellow pages. Good luck. -Marc Marc -- takeahike at mediaone.net - Sunday, 12/31/00 19:17:40 GMT Luke, I got my fire brick at a local refractory contractor who also sells the bricks they use. This stuff insulating fire brick, which is not the same as fireplace bricks. It's much lighter and cuts easily with a fine-toothed saw. I've been told that regular fireplace brick is more of a heat-sink than an insulator. Look under refractories in your yellow pages. Good luck. -Marc Marc -- takeahike at mediaone.net - Sunday, 12/31/00 23:28:05 GMT Hello everyone, happy new year! steve -- e26fish at aol.com - Tuesday, 01/02/01 05:17:23 GMT |